A Hypothetical Trade Offer for Chris Paul | Magic Basketball

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Jul 27

A Hypothetical Trade Offer for Chris Paul, Part I

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Photo by Chris Graythen/Getty Images

A few days ago, Ryan Schwan of Hornets247 conjured up a neat idea of “virtually” trading Chris Paul for fun. The premise was simple — any TrueHoop Network writer could participate and submit an offer to Schwan, then he would gather the offers, rank them, and trade Paul to the team with the best bid. I went ahead and threw my hat into the ring to try to see if I could put together a deal that would stand out from my colleagues and appeal to Schwan the most.

I tried to make my offer as realistic as possible and in accordance with the collective bargaining agreement, but it’s worth noting that I didn’t hesitate to pull out all the stops to try to come away with the best deal. The process, itself, was transparent so everyone involved knew what the bids were, which made it an interesting exercise since we could all see what people were willing to give up for Paul in an alternate reality. Schwan won’t make the decision until later tonight, so none of the participants knows who won the bidding war.

However, feel free to check out my offer.

New Orleans Hornets receive:

– Vince Carter (semi-expiring $18.3 million contract in 2012, $4 million guaranteed if waived before June 30, 2011)
– Jameer Nelson
– Marcin Gortat
– Brandon Bass (or Ryan Anderson)
– $3 million in cash (to cover the expense of waiving Carter)
– 2011 first round pick
– 2013 first round pick

Orlando Magic receive:

– Chris Paul
– Emeka Okafor
– James Posey

Yes, it works in ESPN’s Trade Machine.

_______

Three quick notes:

– It’s important to note that in real life, general manager Otis Smith would definitely pause at the prospect of acquiring Okafor, let alone him and Posey. Both players are overpaid, and Okafor would be an extremely expensive back-up center that wouldn’t receive much playing time. There’s no way that Okafor and Dwight Howard would be able to play together, other than in spurts, so it’d make little sense for them to start as a tandem. This is one of the many reasons why people wonder if a third team would have to be involved to take Okafor off the Magic’s hands. As for Posey, he’s 33 and a shell of his former self (he posted a PER of 8.7 this season, which is awful). The Hornets gave him the full mid-level exception in 2009, and the contract was a mistake from the start.

– For those that are curious, the projected starting lineup for Orlando would be Paul, J.J. Redick, Quentin Richardson, Rashard Lewis, and Howard. Coming off the bench would be Chris Duhon, Mickael Pietrus, James Posey, Brandon Bass or Ryan Anderson, and Okafor. But remember, Okafor has no business being a reserve when he deserves to start somewhere even if he’s overpriced. Nevertheless, this is why the Magic are the preferred destination for Paul. Smith has accumulated so many assets (one of his favorite words), with the blessing of Rich DeVos‘ open checkbook, that Orlando would not leave the cupboard bare with Paul on board. And there’s no question that Paul is aware of that.

– The questions that I’ve pondered with my offer is if Schwan, or the Hornets for that matter, would be willing to acquire Nelson with Darren Collison on board? Collison and Nelson can each play off the ball, at times, but still. Also, is New Orleans saving enough money with Carter’s semi-expiring contract? There’s no question that the Hornets would be accumulating young talent but there are other teams in the NBA that can help them shed more salary, even immediately. That’s one of the reasons why the Charlotte Bobcats have been listed as a potential destination for Paul because they have Erick Dampier’s $13 million contract that is unguaranteed. Which means that the Hornets could waive Dampier and save money right away.

Is my deal good enough?

Stay tuned.

53 comments
Eddy Rivera
Eddy Rivera

@yogi

Wouldn't work. Carter has to be involved in the deal, or else there's no incentive for the Hornets to make a trade since they're not shedding any salary.

@supermagicfan

Collude? James, Wade, and Bosh were free agents. They did nothing wrong. Players are allowed to talk to each other.

@Arie

To be honest, I don't think the Magic have much of a chance winning a championship with the current core. I'm not saying Orlando doesn't have a shot to win a title because they do, but it's going to be difficult with this group.

Arie
Arie

I would love for the Magic to get CP3 as this would give us the biggest shot at competing for the title. However, my first choice is of course, for the Magic to win it all with its current core intact (and by core I mean the players who have been with us for quite sometime) - Dwight, Jameer, JJ, Rashard and Marcin. Somehow the championship would mean a teeny tiny less if we don't get it with the old crew.

supermagicfan
supermagicfan

As an obsessive Magic Fan, I say to whatever it takes to get Paul.

As an even more obsessive NBA fan, I say MAKE HIM HONOR HIS CONTRACT. Miami has started a dangerous trend by allowing players to collude to create the Wade, LeBron, Bosh trio in Miami. If the NBA AND OWNERS don't stop this trend right now, every player in the league who thinks he's a superstar, which is about 50%, will be working behind the scenes to force trades. Funny, the owners aren't allowed to collude.

The NBA and owners need to start realizing they have created a monster when they began allowing all the rinky dink exceptions to the salary cap. The cap and the draft are supposed to cause parity and level the playing field, but as it is now, a player develops over the first three years after being drafted and then the big market teams scoop them up.

yogi
yogi

@ Eddy

salaries would match, but there would be a void at the SG position for sure. no offense against Redick, but Redick is not VC. I also agree VC is getting old and stuff and cant get to the rim etc., but which player has not shied away from the rim while gettin older. we could probably use pietrus in the trade.

Nelson makes $ 8.1 mill
Pietrus $ 5.3 million
Gortat $ 5.9 million
Bass $4 million.

Thats approximately 24 million.

Paul makes 15 million
Okafor makes 11 million, a total of 26 mill which isnt bad.

I am not sold on the posey deal anyway. So Okafor could come off the bench for the 10-15 mins a night, for which he is overpaid, but meanwhile we can develop daniel orton for the same 10 mins a night. This move would benefit Bass also to an extent, as he went to LSU.

1st/2nd unit:
PG: Paul/duhon
SG: VC/Redick
SF: quentin/VC/stanley robinson(if signed)
PF: lewis/anderson
C: howard/okafor/daniel orton

By doin this we can keep the core somewhat intact (Redick/VC/Lewis/Howard) considering we are gettin the best upgrade at PG in the form of CP3. and maybe also sign Patrick Ewing Jr for a small price for a back up wing player.

Just a thought. What do u feel eddy

eltharion_doa
eltharion_doa

3 team trade, Charlotte Bobcats, Orlando Magic, New Orleans Hornets

Charlotte get: Jameer Nelson, Emeka Okafor*, draft picks
Orlando gets: Chris Paul, James Posey, DeSagana Diop
New Orleans gets: Vince Carter, Ryan Anderson, Marcin Gortat, Erick Dampier*, cash, draft picks

*Occurs in seperate trade due to rules regarding Charlotte's acquisition of Dampier

Hornets get two quality young players on good deals, an immediately expiring contract, and a veteran swingman on an essentially expiring contract. Bobcats immediately upgrade both starting key positions. Orlando gets Chris Paul. Everyone wins.

Alex
Alex

@Mikeyho
The "wait a year for this group to do (insert whatever outcome we end up with at the end of the year)" is fantastic until Paul gets shipped to (insert team, probably in the East, who doesn't have to compete with a bid from the Magic, if the front office has the same plan as you do) that makes it *that* much harder for Orlando in the playoffs.

Eddy Rivera
Eddy Rivera

@Mikeyho

My views of the players on the Magic has remained consistent. Do I think Orlando is an elite team? Yes. Do I think Orlando is better than Miami? No, but it's fair to question me since the Heat haven't played a game and nothing is ever a guarantee in the NBA.

I'll happily hold onto my thoughts of Miami and I have no problem admitting when I'm wrong. I just feel strongly about this topic because I think some people are underestimating how good the Heat are going to be, even though they have a glaring weakness at center against teams like the Lakers and the Magic. Sure, that's fair. But there's no way that you can compare this version of the Heat to the 2009 Cavaliers. None. They don't have anyone close to being as good as Wade or Bosh. Whether people like it or not, the Cavs got as far as they did because James produced like Jordan in his prime. Now James has the help of Wade and Bosh, as well as a good supporting cast buoyed by Haslem, Miller, and others. I have no doubt in my mind that, as long as Miami stays healthy, they have a chance to field one of the best offensive teams in league history with a top-five defense. Orlando has a tall task in front of them. People continue to spout the Howard advantage at center and that's fine, but the Magic still have to deal with James, Wade, and Bosh on the flip-side.

We can revisit this topic later. I'll be here. Hah.

Mikeyho
Mikeyho

@Eddy Rivera

The thing that most surprises me is our new view of our players. Views that were not expressed before Paul. In my opinion.

About being crazy. I've obviously stated that bringing in a Chris Paul is great. My opinion was if I were Otis, I could wait and see this talented group have their shot, rather than shop my players.

I meant that the, we need to trade our players (Milicic) to get to that next level mentality, is still here today. We had reason to dream about great changes back then. I'm just surprised we dream about something that might not happen, today.

Finally, when this trade doesn't happen, I'll look forward to you holding on to those thoughts about the Magic not being able to beat the Heat. You and the 08/09 Cavs can wait and see what a dominate center can do to an overwhelming favorite like the heat. We haven't even seen this year's older version of Dwight (or the Heat for that matter) yet... and our new shooters. I respect John Hollinger's opinion a lot, and he was wrong about so many playoffs this year. Don't be too confident about your opinion that the Magic need change (or play out of their minds) to compete with the Heat.

I'll make these statements at the beginning of the playoffs when the Magic win 60+ games this year. Bring it on Heat. I'm going to cheer for the team we have that can beat the heat.

This is the last you'll hear of me cause I'm obviously off-topic. Back to trade scenarios talk. Have fun.

Eddy Rivera
Eddy Rivera

@yogi

Has to be Carter. Only way the salaries match. And even if the Hornets asked for Redick, they can't have him until December 15 at the earliest. Don't quote me on the date, but I'm pretty sure that's the soonest he'd be available for trade.

yogi
yogi

@Eddy Rivera
hi eddy does carter have to be included in the trade if at all it happens. nelson has to be moved if CP3 has to come to orlando.

what happens if NO asks for JJ Redick instead of carter.

Eddy Rivera
Eddy Rivera

@Alex

I don't think the memo means anything.

As for average age, that doesn't mean anything either. There's a metric that was created by Kevin Pelton of Basketball Prospectus and it's called effective age, which takes into account the age of a team in the NBA by taking into account minutes played (the TRUE indicator of age).

And finally, the cap figure would be nearly the same if the Magic took on Paul and Okafor, depending on what they shipped out. That's not the issue. The problem is that Okafor has four years remaining on his contract, which limits the amount of flexibility that Smith has to tweak the roster accordingly. This is why Turkoglu didn't re-sign with Orlando. For this very reason.

Your scenario down the road has to be thrown out the window because the collective bargaining agreement WILL change, but no one knows what the new deal will look like.

@RESTORESPECIFIC

Yeah ... that trade idea wouldn't get far.

@JP

Taking into account the trade kicker (nice catch, by the way), the trade would still work according to the collective bargaining agreement. That's one more reason why taking on Posey's salary would be a burden, though it wouldn't be as bad as inheriting Okafor's four year, $53 million contract.

As for your three-team deal, not bad. Not sure if it would fly in real life, but there's a foundation to work with. Nicely done. The Pacers are one of the teams, I feel, would be a logical landing spot for Nelson. However, Okafor would be an issue because Indiana has Hibbert. That's something you'd have to work around.

@Mikeyho

You make some valid points, but the harsh reality is that the group that the Magic are going to trout out next season -- as of now -- isn't good enough to beat the Heat. Again, I've studied this matchup long and hard, and Orlando has very little margin for error against Miami. In essence, Nelson, Lewis, and Howard would have to play out of their minds to make it a winnable series. I know each of those players could get the job done, but at the same time? Nelson played out of his mind in the playoffs and STILL had off-nights. There's no question that Nelson is an All-Star caliber point guard, but he doesn't have it in him to be dominant on a nightly basis. Notice I didn't mention Carter? I don't have a personal vendetta against Carter, but Wade would eat him alive head-to-head. Keeping Carter around for the sake of continuity doesn't make sense when you're losing that matchup anyway. Brandon Bass, even if he played, wouldn't make much of an impact on the floor. With Paul and Howard, you attack the Heat at their weakest spots with the best players at those positions! That's two top five players! From a talent standpoint, the Magic would be closing the gap.

That's important. No offense, but you're crazy if you think that Orlando doesn't need to bring in Paul. This is nowhere near the same situation as Howard and Milicic. That's Kahn logic right there.

derekk
derekk

@Mikeyho
I agree with most of what you say, but still E more here; that CP3 is a superstar, top 5 guy in the league, and at a position of weakness to LA and MIA no less too. I would take CP3/D12/RL9 core any day of the week, we'd still prolly have JJ/MP, and probably one of Ryan/Bass for backup PF.

Mikeyho
Mikeyho

@Alex

Otis said he thinks Vince Carter and Brandon Bass will benefit the most from another year in Van Gundy's system... so I'm not so worried about VC. I want to wait a year because the team we have is good and we can wait. What a great opportunity to be good enough to win a championship this year and have a great opportunity next off season.

We can keep our chemistry this year, and do exactly what we could now next year. Opportunities will always be there.

I'm not against bringing in a Chris Paul, I just don't think we need to. If we don't need to, and we can wait, I would.

Alex
Alex

@Mikeyho

So you want to wait a year because..?

You think we'll be better in the postseason this year because...?

Vince will drive to the basketball (and finish, not fade away) now that hes a year older..?

Duhon will be able to contain Rondo..?

CP3, JJ, Qtip, Lewis, and Howard are better than Nelson, Carter, Qtip, Lewis, and Howard.

Mikeyho
Mikeyho

I just don't buy it. I've been on this bus before, especially right after we drafted Howard and had Milicic. So much chatter about who would put us over the top. We're here, and we're still talking.

Let Chris Paul go to the Bobcats if he's so unsatisfied with the Hornets. We'll knock him out of the playoffs, and he'll regret leaving New Orleans. Then we can try to swing a trade for him (or a power forward I trust Otis can find) the next season after Jameer and co. win a championship.

derekk
derekk

@JP
Very cool stuff. I did not know the ins and outs of the TK in effect like you just showed. That will make it slightly easier to include Posey in any potential deal should the season start.

Alex
Alex

@JR

I've looked at and toyed with that trade too. Its the most realistic and do-able trade I've seen or come up with. I'm just not familiar enough with the Pacer organization and how they spend (or don't spend) their money. And I'm not sure if they believe or don't believe in Roy Hibbert being their big man.

JP
JP

@derekk

No worries.

That amount though is only valid between now and the start of the season. After that, the amount of 2010/11 salary used to calculate the trade kicker is recdued by 1/180th for each day that passes.

So if 90 days have passed this upcomming season and hes traded, the trade kicker amount is 10% of 2010/11 season divided by 2, and 10% of 2011/12 season added togeter. That amount is then equal applied to both seasons salary. In this case, Poseys salary would be 6,986,835 for the 2010/11 season and be used for trade parameters.

Alex
Alex

@Miguel

Orlando "isn't getting any younger"? I think our average age is something around 26 years old.

If we trade for Paul and take on Emeka too (and I've said this before), our cap figure would be 3-7 million more than it is now after you figure the salaries of the players being traded out.

You wanna know why the Hornets are in the position they are in now? Look at the contracts of Peja, Posey, and Emeka. Posey and Peja were given RIDICULOUS contracts for players who were ALREADY past their prime.

Orlando's worst contract (which is up their among the league's worst) is Rashard.

Jameer has a fantastic contract. Dwight is a max player. Everybody else has a manageable contract.

Two years from now (under this Paul on Orlando scenario) we'd have Howard and CP3 prolly opting out or getting extended. If they opt out, that frees up their money, they're already max players, so we could keep them for the same price. Pietrus' contract will be up (if hes not traded). Bass' will be up (if hes not traded). *IF* we take Posey's contract, that will be up (6-7 million) That would free up almost 17 million. We'll have a mid-level exception and a bi-annual exception. We'd have contracts committed to JJ, Qtip, Rashard, Duhon, and Emeka (assuming Nelson and Gortat are no longer on the team). They're total cap figure is 46.4 million.

In other words, what are you talking about?

derekk
derekk

@JP
Thanks for showing us the exact amount, that's always very useful, especially for us who love to check the numbers the old fashioned way.

Mikeyho
Mikeyho

@Eddy Rivera

Not now. Next year. I just think we should wait one more year. After we give ourselves a shot this year.

Eddy Rivera
Eddy Rivera

@Miguel

You didn't read what I wrote. It's unlikely that the Magic would take on Okafor's contract, given his price tag. My idea is hypothetical.

Homers? No one here is proclaiming that acquiring Paul would mean a title would be waiting at Orlando's doorstep. Not at all. Trading for Paul would give the Magic a better chance to compete against the Heat, and maybe the Lakers if they get that far, from a pure talent perspective. As for Paul's health, he had a rash of minor injuries this year. People had similar doubts that Wade would be the same player again a few years ago, yet he recovered nicely with some rest. I have no doubt in my mind that Paul will return to form next season.

@Mikeyho

Wait.

You're wary of acquiring a top five player and the best point guard in the NBA that is 25 and in the middle of his prime? Besides, name me a premiere power forward that is available via trade right now? Boozer, Bosh, and Stoudemire are off the market and honestly, only Bosh and Stoudemire would have made a difference against the Lakers. Boozer's struggles against them are well-documented. Instead, Orlando can attack teams like Miami and Los Angeles at their weakest position.
_______

I'll respond to everyone else later. I just needed to chime in with that real quick.

JR
JR

So I've got a three team trade (NO, IND, ORL) that is less complicated than the other multi-team contracts

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=254qtjt

IND: Nelson, Okafor, Bass
NO: Carter's expiring, Ford's expiring, Gortat, and Anderson (Money and Picks)
ORL: Paul, Murphy, Posey

This gives NO more financial flexibility with 2 expiring contracts, provides Indiana a solid three-man core who could push for a playoff spot, and we get Paul and Murphy who would fit excellently into our system.

JP
JP

@derekk

I havent checked the numbers in all the trade scenarios mentioned but you're right that Posey has a trade kicker (10%).

If a trade was done before the start of the season, Posey would get an extra 1,340,400 on top of his contract with the amount split equally over both remaining years. Therefore, his salary (both actual and for trade purposes) if a deal done before the start of the season, would be 7,148,800 for 2010/11 instead of the amount shown on the trade machine.

Mikeyho
Mikeyho

I agree with Miguel. We already have a good team and don't need to trade Carter and Nelson for one player. Besides, we still need to add size at the PF to compete with the Lakers. Paul doesn't solve that.

Miguel
Miguel

Wait, isn't this how Hornet's ended going from promising to horrible- by having huge and overpaid contracts which made them stuck and unable to make moves?

I GUARANTEE if the Magic take Paul's and Okefar's contract that in two years, the Magic will be in the same position that the Hornets are in no: over the cap and stuck in a rut because they have no flexibility. There is no way that they can afford Howard's contract, Paul's contract, Okefor's contact, and Lewis' without serious financial repercussions to their team. Not to mention that the team is not getting any younger and giving up two first round draft picks will mean that the team will get even older more quickly.

I love all the homer's that think Chris Paul's acquisition means automatic Championship for Magic, because it doesn't. There would be still holes to the Magic that Chris Paul couldn't address. I am not even convinced that Chris Paul will ever be the same Chris Paul again with his recent injury woes.

derekk
derekk

For the sake of correcting my first post where I had a two part deal for CP3, Meka and Posey, I had Bass and Ryan for Posey but it would also take Orton too because of Posey's TK. Taking Orton and Ryan from the first deal and adding them into the second deal makes both trade deals legal still, and as such doesn't affect any reasonings or savings for New Orleans in trading.

I think, for the sake of being CBA- legal, the ESPN trade machine might not be taking into account Posey's TK in their trade scenarios, so many deals that are particularly looking to take advantage of the 125%-plus-100k rule will actually be illegal. Most deals in general tho, should be just fine and legal if we're using the ESPN trade machine.

Alex
Alex

@Restore

I don't think Houston or Indianapolis does that trade.

derekk
derekk

From a negotiations stand point and actually getting CP3 here, I think NO is going to take the best offer available, so you go to what Orlando can do to make it happen and what CP3's camp can do to make it happen. These are the two fundamental keys to getting CP3 to Orlando.

And IMO, CP3's camp's job is actually more critical for a big reason. His camp may have potetially 0 leverage with NO but CP3 can, via his agents, *threaten FA opt out in 2 years on many teams* that he doesn't have on his preferred list, or don't like. I think this is alrdy showing itself somewhat because of Paul's preferred lists, but also because Paul seems really "star-struck." it should be a big fat warning to many other teams in the league like Charlotte and New Jersey (who would, without heeding the warning, make a very competitive offer). Paul's agents should propagate on Paul's super star companion(s) wishes, and then *actually* let many teams know that CP3 *opt* into FA ASAP if they trade for him (and waste all those assets that brought CP3 over to begin with). Hell, I was alrdy worrying about this alittle bc of CP3 if he came to Orlando, imagine every other team now. It remains to be seen if CP3's camp will do this but I'm sure they are entertaining all possibilites. It also remains to be seen if CP3's LeBron/MiamiTrio-tied CAA agency will actually not *fully* work to bring CP3 to Orlando, the rival of the "king." But I think they respect CP3 and the honest merits of agent-player duties.

From Orlando's side, it is less critical in the negotiations. These would be less what the actual trade would be, and more of just making sure that Orlando has reached out privately and very amicably to CP3's camp, that Orlando is willing to take on Okafor if needed, and even potentially researching/exploring 3-ways involving Meka and/or Meer. Of the first two, I'm sure Orlando has already done actually. Looking at media articles only, CP3's camp can alrdy figure out it is Otis' dream to acquire CP3 and the player-love between D12 and CP3 is documented. And Im going to assume Orlando will take on Okafor because, 1) DeVos is a big spender, check out the team payroll, 2) the Magic have alrdy been paying a backup C 6-7 mil for a year, and what looks like another year+. Also, the Magic decided to overpay VC's two years over a cheaper thru-2-years on Turk, so they spend and will hold onto/trade assets later if they have to.

RESTORESPECIFIC
RESTORESPECIFIC

@Eddy Rivera

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=2dp2lvk

On a scale from 1-10 with 10 being a done deal for all involved where would you put this trade? My question would be whether Okafor is worth getting Granger and if Indy is willing to blow it up and start over. Because even with Granger there is no way they are more then a 1st round team. Also part of the trade would be the 2011 and 2013 pick from the Magic and Houston would give up a Knicks pick to NO.

Alex
Alex

@Eddy
What do you think about the memo the NBA sent out, warning teams about tampering with CP3?

Eddy Rivera
Eddy Rivera

@Mikeyho

Because Paul is a top five player, end of story. And you have to think about playoff matchups with this scenario. If the Magic got a top-flight small forward, he'd get shut down defensively by James and Artest. There's no one on the Lakers or the Heat that could stop Paul. Gortat, Bass, or Carter can't make a difference in the playoffs. Paul can. Yeah, Rondo would be able to slow down Paul but I'm skeptical that the Celtics will be a similar threat as they were last year.

Eddy Rivera
Eddy Rivera

@JP

It was a straightforward process. Everyone put in their bid, gave a brief explanation as to why the deal would appeal to the Hornets, and that was it. I made my case for the Magic as eloquently as I could.

@MightyMouth

That's part of it, yeah. I wouldn't put too much stock in the wins projection based on PER. It's too volatile of a system to rely on.

@hulKK

I see almost no scenario in which the Hornets will be able to construct a championship contender in two years. And even then, they'd be facing stiff competition with the Lakers and whoever else emerges in the Western Conference as an elite team.

New Orleans didn't convince Paul to stay. The meeting yesterday was purely a spin tactic to fend off the wolves.

@Ryan

Pietrus' contract may be "expiring" technically but he has a player option in 2012, and it would behoove him not to exercise it. It's somewhat true that the Hornets don't need Nelson, but they can flip him to another team if necessary.

There's almost no way that the Magic would be able to keep Nelson. And Duhon defending shooting guards would be a disaster. That arrangement wouldn't work. Duhon is strictly a point guard. That's the reality of the situation.

@Mikeyho

Nelson would have to be traded in any CP3 scenario.

@Alex

There's no strict rules, per se. If some writers wanted to get together to execute a three-team trade, that'd be perfectly fine. The only issue is coming up with a deal that would be realistic and satisfy all parties involved.

@Michael

Trust me, even with the hassle of taking on Okafor's contract, the Magic would be a better team with Paul and Howard as the centerpieces. Those are two of the top five players in the NBA, and the best at their respective positions. Redick and Richardson would be perfect compliments because they're low-usage, high-efficiency players. And Lewis would return to being the third option offensively, which is a good thing. I don't see why Orlando couldn't flirt with having the most efficient team on offense in the league, while maintaining a top-five defense.

@Tim James

Yeah, Nelson deserves to start. Whether it's with the Magic or elsewhere.

derekk
derekk

This is deftly one of the best trade offers out there in the league, and among the other Magic-Hornets trade offers. I don't know what exactly the ex-Spur GM may want, but I think the trade will either be dictated by savings first and then talent, or talent first and then savings, because this is defintely among the talent first offers with great young big men and Meer. Your offer actually makes NO lose a little money with the trade off the bat, but does provide substantial savings second year. Perhaps adding Songaila from NO will be appreciated to cut into the first year debt, and big man depth is always nice for Orl. Regardless of whatever offer Orl sends out, I'm sure they will *explore* getting Okafor elsewhere in a 3-way but I think they *might* also will try to 3-way Meer to some teams with PG needs. Indy can give Foster and his expiring contract/rights (VC and Foster should be more useful/talented bird rights for later potential S/Ts) , one/two of their rookie scale guys (Rush), and one/(two) picks where one is 1st unprotected. I think Meer is worth more but it's a deal that Im guessing Indy might really take up and has the assets useful to NO since they are all re-routed NO's way. 3-waying Meer like that also distinguishes Orl from other offers by providing more and being one of a few offers not giving NO a PG stud/prospect in return, where they have DC alrdy. I don't think it will be 3-wayed unless NO let's Orl know it's seriously interested in dealing CP3, and would like the 3-way returns and any patience necessary to process it thru from all sides.

But back to the general Orlando offers, I think a potential competeing offer will be one geared towards savings, then talent. So I have Ryan, Orton, VC & his expiring, two 1st rounders and two 2nd rounders, and Gortat for Paul and Emeka. Then there's a second deal of Posey for Bass (restructure deal to add Ryan here too and make it legal) or Meer straight up (or with yet even more cash, picks too) *at NO's option* so they can decide if they themselves want to jump into Bass or Meers cheap, but still longterm contracts. That first deal will do much better job with savings, they went from seriously paying Paul and Meka to only Gortat now (every1 else is expiring or rookie scale), and sincerely speaking, Gortat is a much cheaper, younger and better Meka type center which is much needed for a rebuild (C depth is important!). The second is if NO wants some more talent, they are still saving money overall with both deals , and even separately if it's Bass/Ryan for Posey. I think this two part deal will be the best offer, and any crazy 3-waying Meer to Indy, or wherever gives NO a similar package that Indy is giving to NO in Foster, Rush, and two picks (1st and 2nd), will easily kill other offers. (PS, sorry for lengthy comment, but it's CP3 :P ).

Mikeyho
Mikeyho

Why break up our team for Paul when we could use Gortat, Bass, or Vince to get a dominate SF? I'm starting to think I don't like this speculation of losing Jameer and Carter. We have one more shot with this team to gel more and then Vince is already gone and we'll have the same options next year. I do understand Paul would be great.

Tim James
Tim James

I'm not sure Jameer could survive coming off the bench. With his attitude and drive, he ought to start somewhere.

Michael
Michael

Getting Paul is a huge win, but unless they can ship Okafor for a two/three then I'm not convinced that the trade leads to a better team (at least in the short term). I'm very skeptical that any team starting JJ and Q can compete for (let alone win) a title.

Alex
Alex

@ Eddy
For this contest, are you allowed to use a third team?

Mikeyho
Mikeyho

I like Ryan's trade. Just cause I don't want to lose Jameer.

Ryan
Ryan

If you want to make the trade more appealing to the Hornets, replace Jameer with Pietrus' expiring $5.3 million contract. NO has no need for Jameer with Collison around. They would get a young starting center (Gortat) and another young big (Bass) locked up for a few years at reasonable prices. And next year they wipe Vince and Pietrus off their payroll ($20.3 million). If you wanted to throw in a few million to help with Vince's buyout, you could do that, too. No other team in the league can come close to an offer like this unless they were willing to trade their superstar.

Magic would keep Jameer in this deal who could *hopefully* be a Jason Terry-type 6th man (instant offense; no defense). If that doesn't work, they could trade either Jameer or Duhon at some point during the season. Our lineup would be Paul, JJ, Q, Rashard, & Dwight starting. With Jameer, Duhon, Posey, Anderson, and Okafor off the bench. Jameer could play off the ball on offense, and Duhon can defend the twos on defense.

This is an excellent deal for both teams.

hulKK
hulKK

@Eddy Rivera

What if NO finds a way bring in help for Chris Paul? Do you know any possible moves NO could make that would make their current team a contender? Do you think there's any team out there willing to take Okafor, Peja or Posey's contract in a trade?

I don't see NO being put in a position to compete for a championship and win until the next yr or two. How did they convince Paul to agree to stay and play 2yrs worth of irrelevant games?

MightyMouth
MightyMouth

I noticed that with the trade you proposed, Hollinger's system actually predicts the Magic's win total decreasing by 1. Do you think that result is a little off base because of Anderson's high PER (despite his relatively little playing time)? If not, what would be the reason?

JP
JP

Cheers for the response Eddy.

I take it that all the bloggers were allowed to improve their offers then? Ie, if you'd put in an offer, saw another team with a deal that you perceived to be better then your own, you were able to improve your own offer? Or was it all "blind" until you made your own offer and only afterwards, do you see all the other bids without the ability to improve your own?

Eddy Rivera
Eddy Rivera

@Tim

Anderson would definitely be more appealing. I just chose Bass because he's more expendable than Anderson, though I wouldn't hesitate to give up the latter player if push came to shove. I prefer Anderson because he's a better fit with the Magic, but I won't let him stop a trade for Chris Paul coming to fruition.

Tim
Tim

This is the exact same trade that I have been pondering lately. It has to be pretty appealing to NO especially with Anderson as opposed to Bass- smaller contract, expires sooner, higher upside- once you swallow the bitter pill that you're going to lose Paul.

Eddy Rivera
Eddy Rivera

@C.J.

No, it's not. The trade works with either Anderson or Bass.

C.J.
C.J.

It would have to be Brandon Bass. Anderson's contract is too small to make the trade work.

Eddy Rivera
Eddy Rivera

@Adolfo

Not sure. If push came to shove, Orton could be the back-up center but he's not ready to play yet so I don't know if he's a viable option. There's plenty of options out there, just depends on who's available and what not.

@RESTORESPECIFIC

I don't think the financial situation is as dire as the owners make it out to be. That being said, I don't know the answer to that question. I'm speculating.

@Tim James

Paul had an injury-plagued season this year, but he didn't suffer any serious injuries. Paul's worst injury was when he tore his meniscus in his left knee, which is the EXACT injury that Nelson had and he recovered fine. I don't think there's much to worry about, in my opinion. There will always be risks involved, but that comes with the territory of pursuing a championship.

@JP

I know what the offers are. I just didn't want to spoil the fun. Schwan will reveal everything later tonight. I'll post a link when he does make his choice.

JP
JP

Tim James :
Has anyone talked about Chris Paul’s durability? Nelson isn’t very reliable either, but I would hate to change everything and have Paul go down. It’s double or nothing, and with the luck of the Magic’s organization I wouldn’t take that bet.  Tim James

Its a fair point (something I have suspicion about Wade with the Heat too by the way.) There'd definitely be some risk attached to acquiring Paul in this regard but I'm of the view that it would be a risk worth taking as long as the trade was subject to passable medicals (something that isnt always conducted when trades occur.)

JP
JP

My guess is that this offer would immediately blow out about 80% of the other offers but would be "touch and go" compared to the other 20%. All depending upon on what direction & importance "the Hornets" (Schwan) place on the different dynamics of each offer. If more emphasis is place on the financial side instead of on court talent, then this offer is going to struggle to win out in my view but also, the opposite applies too.

Eddy, let us know some of the other offers too when you find out. :)